Just added a link to Eternal Vigilance authored by friends Tim Wikiriwhi and Richard Goode. Both Libertarians but not Libertarianz.
Being Christians they were rejected by Objectivist Libertarians. I always thought Libertarians were about live and let live. I wouldn't deny someone their faith. It mightn't be for me but I abhor anti-religionism when it takes on all the fanaticism of some religions.
Richard is standing for the ALCP in Mana and Tim is standing as an Independent in Hamilton West. Good luck guys. I admire your courage and conviction.
Fiscal failure and indifference
1 hour ago
12 comments:
Thanks, Lindsay. :-)
To be fair, it was as much a case of we rejected them! A voluntary disassociation. I wish the Libz every future success.
“And that is the whole of their shabby secret. The secret of all their esoteric philosophies, of all their dialectics and super-senses, of their evasive eyes and snarling words, the secret for which they destroy civilization, language, industries and lives, the secret for which they pierce their own eyes and eardrums, grind out their senses, blank out their minds, the purpose for which they dissolve the absolutes of reason, logic, matter, existence, reality—is to erect upon that plastic fog a single holy absolute: their Wish.”
I'd not realised you'd split with Libertarianz Richard.
As an Objectivist, of course I have no truck with the mysticism but at this stage anyone observing the non-initiation of force principle (which takes the teeth from the mysticism regardless), and most importantly, striving for limited government, still rank as the 'good guys' :) Libertarians have to be about, as you say, Lindsay, live and let live, so long as no one is pushing to control me and I am a free agent.
Good luck.
Mark Hubbard
Thank you Richard for clarifying the reason for your departure. I wish you both well.
As an atheist I believe very much in the live and let live approach. Your religion is your business nothing to do with me. Just as my non religion is nothing to do with any one else and certainly nothing to do with the state. All the best.
When it comes to rugby, win or lose, I say, "Go the All Blacks!"
But when it comes to politics, all that really matters is kicking the ball through the goalposts of freedom. Libertarianz is Piri Weepu. The ALCP is Stephen Donald. All the other parties have French-sounding names.
Just to clarify, Libz have never rejected Richard or Tim, they both left to pursue their own endeavors and I wish them the all the best in those. Libertarianz has no policy on religion other than it having no place in government. In fact, given that I only found out that Richard is christian a week a go, I can't see how it has played any significance in his dealings with Libz.
Tim took a lot of stick from Objectivists in the early 2000s. I wasn't comfortable with that. Apologies for any misapprehensions and misrepresentations. Otherwise the comments here speak for themselves.
What is this, the Mutual Well-Wishers Society?
What Tim actually said was that we were "shunned as infidels by the Randoid hierarchy". A little hyperbole goes a long way.
“Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State.”
So say we all.
If Tim can refrain from bring up G#d when debating then cool....Sure that's his base for action and that's fine...its just when he attacks others who don't share that base....
Perhaps someone could explain why these two leaving The Libz 'fold' are actually a loss.
Thank you Lindsay. There is no point in venting my spleen regarding the Objectivist bent in the Libz. I have moved on. And James I promised Richard that I would play nice, yet still I will invoke God anytime I believe it to be appropriate. What makes you think only atheists are interested in discussing the politics of Liberty? I may be appealing to those maligned theistic minds in the hope of salvaging them from the sore delusion that Libertarians are all rabid atheist bigots. It may upset you to witness that do not accept your vacuous atheist terms, and will not pander to your small minded sensibilities which deny the intellectual history of Individual inalienable rights or the Great contributions to Liberty and equality by Godly Christians.
'Capitalism'...whoever you are your question proves you don’t know anything about the activities of the Libertarianz Party over the past decade.
Eternal Vigilance will wage War against Socialism and promote Liberty, and the separation of Church and state. I will present arguments from all angles… some secular, others theistic. I hope to encourage that important voting block…The Christians… to embrace Libertarianism. I hope to lay out the reasons why Libertarianism developed from the Protestant Reformation… which was a process of recovery from Millennia of Roman heresy back towards the original non-political purity of Christianity as preached by St Paul. *Thus I intend to restore the Foundations of the doctrine of God given inalienable Rights*.
And to give original well reasoned and insightful commentary on the politics of the day…from a perspective not available on other blogs. Thus I hope Richard and I will complement the other Liberty orientated Blogs (such as Lindsays) in the battle against the socialist Zombie hordes.
Sigh..ok Tim...if we could just stick to the liberty it would be all good.I don't need to repair to atheism to make the case for liberty...just natural facts and the reality about us.If you think that's all Gods work then that's your belief....and not relevant to me.
As somebody said to me last weekend (yes, I have friends who talk like this), the real battle is epistemological.
So, some folk have left Libz and gone to other places? Fine. I've always advocated that students of the Libz Graduate School head out and infiltrate other parties and organisations.
PS: "The real battle is epistemological." Wouldn't that be a great sign to hold up while walking through the Occupy Ayatollah Square crowd. ;-^
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